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My God the Gallente are Evil!

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True Adamance PIE Inc. Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 3974	Posted - 2013.11.07 22:24:00 - [1] - Quote Just read the Caldari POW description "Caldari Prisoners of War Caldari Prisoners of War All of these Caldari P.O.Ws show the signs of appalling treatment over an extended period of time. Even the most well-off are still suffering from starvation and serious malnourishment. The worst of them are barely alive after enduring sleep deprivation, physical abuse and other more excessive forms of torture. The women in particular, have not fared well under their Gallente jail masters, who have remorselessly taken whatever they desired from their captured prey. " Man that really makes me want to kill some FDU scum, vile, and depraved monsters. "All things were created by the Divine, and so the glory of our faith is inherent to us all"
True Adamance PIE Inc. Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 3974	Posted - 2013.11.07 22:30:00 - [2] - Quote Kahn Zo wrote: Oh, do not believe everything that you read. Please. I'm surprised a Gallentean has the balls to say that to me as only 2 players have ever dug deeper into Amarr histories to actually make informed opinions on them. "All things were created by the Divine, and so the glory of our faith is inherent to us all"
True Adamance PIE Inc. Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 3974	Posted - 2013.11.07 22:32:00 - [3] - Quote XANDER KAG wrote: R'adeh Hunt wrote: True Adamance wrote: Just read the Caldari POW description "Caldari Prisoners of War Caldari Prisoners of War All of these Caldari P.O.Ws show the signs of appalling treatment over an extended period of time. Even the most well-off are still suffering from starvation and serious malnourishment. The worst of them are barely alive after enduring sleep deprivation, physical abuse and other more excessive forms of torture. The women in particular, have not fared well under their Gallente jail masters, who have remorselessly taken whatever they desired from their captured prey. " Man that really makes me want to kill some FDU scum, vile, and depraved monsters. Gallente are angels compared to Amarrians. Those guys are EVE's version of the Taliban. Actually its almost the other way around. But with the religious people being the victims. R'adeh you know so little about this universe and you suggestion that the Amarr are like and Islamic religious extremist group (call them what you will) is so ignorant it is like a slap in the face that reminds me why this game is so shallow. You gave no time to even learn what the Amarr are or do. Please do us all a favour and keep your freedom loving mouth shut unless you have something informed to say. "All things were created by the Divine, and so the glory of our faith is inherent to us all"
True Adamance PIE Inc. Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 3974	Posted - 2013.11.07 22:33:00 - [4] - Quote Soldiersaint wrote: True Adamance wrote: Just read the Caldari POW description "Caldari Prisoners of War Caldari Prisoners of War All of these Caldari P.O.Ws show the signs of appalling treatment over an extended period of time. Even the most well-off are still suffering from starvation and serious malnourishment. The worst of them are barely alive after enduring sleep deprivation, physical abuse and other more excessive forms of torture. The women in particular, have not fared well under their Gallente jail masters, who have remorselessly taken whatever they desired from their captured prey. " Man that really makes me want to kill some FDU scum, vile, and depraved monsters. I may be Gallente by I do not approve of this one bit. How the hell can my My people talk about freedom and fair treatment but turn and do this. This is why I stick with my Minmatar allies. I have some respect for you Gallentean, the fact you can acknowledge this proves to me you are one of the less depraved members of your people. "All things were created by the Divine, and so the glory of our faith is inherent to us all"
True Adamance PIE Inc. Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 3974	Posted - 2013.11.07 22:34:00 - [5] - Quote Arkena Wyrnspire wrote: Shall we add the part where Gallentean worlds were sold off to the highest bidder, including the people on them, for 'harvesting'? Shall we talk about where your people bombed the Caldari homeworld, and have not since returned it. Either way Arkena those worlds belonged primarily to the Intaki, not the ethnic Gallente ( according to what I know) "All things were created by the Divine, and so the glory of our faith is inherent to us all"
True Adamance PIE Inc. Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 3974	Posted - 2013.11.07 22:35:00 - [6] - Quote Goro Scornshard wrote: https://wiki.eveonline.com/en/wiki/Two_Deaths_(Chronicle) Again you see a government official make this people commit murder on a massive scale. No responsibility was taken for the mans life, it was spread amongst the people, making monsters of all of them. "All things were created by the Divine, and so the glory of our faith is inherent to us all"
True Adamance PIE Inc. Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 3975	Posted - 2013.11.07 22:41:00 - [7] - Quote Crash Monster wrote: One word... Vitoc. I am not talking about my people here though if you want to bring it up in context I believe it was a Caldari who supplied the antidote to Vitoc to the Matari free of charge..... "All things were created by the Divine, and so the glory of our faith is inherent to us all"
True Adamance PIE Inc. Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 3975	Posted - 2013.11.07 22:44:00 - [8] - Quote XANDER KAG wrote: Dovallis Martan JenusKoll wrote: True Adamance wrote: Just read the Caldari POW description "Caldari Prisoners of War Caldari Prisoners of War All of these Caldari P.O.Ws show the signs of appalling treatment over an extended period of time. Even the most well-off are still suffering from starvation and serious malnourishment. The worst of them are barely alive after enduring sleep deprivation, physical abuse and other more excessive forms of torture. The women in particular, have not fared well under their Gallente jail masters, who have remorselessly taken whatever they desired from their captured prey. " Man that really makes me want to kill some FDU scum, vile, and depraved monsters. There is no such thing as prisoners of war anymore... They just die and clone spawn back to base. This refers to the Mortals, we are not allowed on conventional battlefields, and are only used to counter the other side picking using us. And in such context this act is morally reprehensible. If it were myself this would not matter, I could withstand it, and I would choose to endure it over a mortal.... but to do this to those who could die.... is beyond my capacity for mercy....though I have no delusions about my own people housing POWs.... "All things were created by the Divine, and so the glory of our faith is inherent to us all"
True Adamance PIE Inc. Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 3975	Posted - 2013.11.07 22:45:00 - [9] - Quote Sgt Kirk wrote: Vyzion Eyri wrote: The Caldari. The Gallente. The Minmatar. The Amarr. If we're going to judge based on what we do to other humans in the turmoil of war, then in this regard we are equal. Dammit you beat me to it. True is playing a very old political game that is easily countered as you just did. +1 Hardly, I am not interested in tit for tat politics, you did this to me so I did this to you. (( I was researching Caldari Prison Systems...and found this)) Such strikes a chord with me. I cannot forgive the poor treatment of mortals. "All things were created by the Divine, and so the glory of our faith is inherent to us all"
True Adamance PIE Inc. Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 3975	Posted - 2013.11.07 22:47:00 - [10] - Quote Arkena Wyrnspire wrote: True Adamance wrote: Arkena Wyrnspire wrote: Shall we add the part where Gallentean worlds were sold off to the highest bidder, including the people on them, for 'harvesting'? Shall we talk about where your people bombed the Caldari homeworld, and have not since returned it. Either way Arkena those worlds belonged primarily to the Intaki, not the ethnic Gallente ( according to what I know) This is a whole chain of events. If you're going to talk about the bombardment of Caldari prime, you might want to mention that they razed an entire city, to a man, completely. Every single person in Nouvelle Rouvenor died. No survivors. Oh, you can blame that on terrorist groups, but that was the catalyst for the Gallente-Caldari war. And what does it matter which precise ethnicity was victimised by the Caldari, if they're still Gallente? The Intaki people have their own identity, but they are still a part of the Federation. So, how does those people being Intaki Gallenteans rather than ethnic Gallenteans make any difference? Again I am not interested in tit for tat politics. It was you who brought up the selling of worlds but I fail to understand how this impacts on the poor treatment of POW's within the Federation despite such heroic posturing. No act of war nearly a century prior warrants this treatment of humans, especially amongst those who champion human rights. "All things were created by the Divine, and so the glory of our faith is inherent to us all"

True Adamance PIE Inc. Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 3975	Posted - 2013.11.07 22:48:00 - [11] - Quote XANDER KAG wrote: True Adamance wrote: Crash Monster wrote: One word... Vitoc. I am not talking about my people here though if you want to bring it up in context I believe it was a Caldari who supplied the antidote to Vitoc to the Matari free of charge..... Isn't the Insorium Vaccine OOC? If not then Otro Gariushi will forever be remembered as a great man for that. If it is then, he was still the only public figure trying to stop the current Gallente-Caldari war. (( Ah my mistake then consider it redacted if my character is no supposed to know about that.)) "All things were created by the Divine, and so the glory of our faith is inherent to us all"
True Adamance PIE Inc. Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 3975	Posted - 2013.11.07 22:49:00 - [12] - Quote The Robot Devil wrote: True Adamance wrote: Just read the Caldari POW description "Caldari Prisoners of War Caldari Prisoners of War All of these Caldari P.O.Ws show the signs of appalling treatment over an extended period of time. Even the most well-off are still suffering from starvation and serious malnourishment. The worst of them are barely alive after enduring sleep deprivation, physical abuse and other more excessive forms of torture. The women in particular, have not fared well under their Gallente jail masters, who have remorselessly taken whatever they desired from their captured prey. " Man that really makes me want to kill some FDU scum, vile, and depraved monsters. Yes we are. No vice, no virtue. As they say.<-Me Look up the Eve reader and listen to some of those tortures and you'll see that we are all the same. (( The Amarr one is just plain funny I cannot believe it to be true)) "All things were created by the Divine, and so the glory of our faith is inherent to us all"
True Adamance PIE Inc. Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 3977	Posted - 2013.11.07 22:59:00 - [13] - Quote Arkena Wyrnspire wrote: True Adamance wrote: Sgt Kirk wrote: Vyzion Eyri wrote: The Caldari. The Gallente. The Minmatar. The Amarr. If we're going to judge based on what we do to other humans in the turmoil of war, then in this regard we are equal. Dammit you beat me to it. True is playing a very old political game that is easily countered as you just did. +1 Hardly, I am not interested in tit for tat politics, you did this to me so I did this to you. (( I was researching Caldari Prison Systems...and found this)) Such strikes a chord with me. I cannot forgive the poor treatment of mortals. Poor treatment of mortals? Hypocrit, much? The sheer number of atrocities you and your people have committed against human beings are unthinkable. I cannot speak for my people in the past, what we were does not shape who we are now, only shapes the base. I am not blameless in the image people have of the Amarr, if anything I am a symbol of it, though I hold not slaves, or noble blood. So you say I am to blame for the mistakes of my ancestors? Are you personally responsible for the bombing on Caldari Prime? Poor treatment of mortals as you say is not hypocritical, though I respect the need for the Matari to face their own spiritual awakening I will not stand for the mistreatment of slaves. Too many way ward criminals have I hunted down, slaving without the Empires consent, too many Blood Raider facilities have I razed, or Holders detained under the auspices of the Ministries for their sins. You speak as if I do not understand the human condition because of my Faith. "All things were created by the Divine, and so the glory of our faith is inherent to us all"
True Adamance PIE Inc. Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 3977	Posted - 2013.11.07 23:00:00 - [14] - Quote Soldiersaint wrote: Let us not forget that no Empire is without sin. Why did this war even start? I joined the fight to help The Minmatar because I thought they were fighting off enslavement from the Amarr Empire. Is that not why this war started. Perhaps a veteran of the war can correct me? Again I have not mentioned here my stance on the Empire, it is not necessarily within context. I merely speak of the state of half a dozen Caldari POWs transferred to a ship I was stationed on while on active duty. "All things were created by the Divine, and so the glory of our faith is inherent to us all"
True Adamance PIE Inc. Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 3977	Posted - 2013.11.07 23:07:00 - [15] - Quote Atiim wrote: Yeah, and the Amarr are so good and definitely more ethical. Again I have not mentioned my stance on the Empire, this is not about what my people have done, I misunderstand the need man people seem to have about not being able to accept their actions and feeling the need to throw back tit for tat politics to defend themselves. "All things were created by the Divine, and so the glory of our faith is inherent to us all"
True Adamance PIE Inc. Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 3977	Posted - 2013.11.07 23:09:00 - [16] - Quote BL4CKST4R wrote: True Adamance wrote: Just read the Caldari POW description "Caldari Prisoners of War Caldari Prisoners of War All of these Caldari P.O.Ws show the signs of appalling treatment over an extended period of time. Even the most well-off are still suffering from starvation and serious malnourishment. The worst of them are barely alive after enduring sleep deprivation, physical abuse and other more excessive forms of torture. The women in particular, have not fared well under their Gallente jail masters, who have remorselessly taken whatever they desired from their captured prey. " Man that really makes me want to kill some FDU scum, vile, and depraved monsters. Oh because a couple of POW can compare for the enslavement of an entire race *Facepalms AM I COMPARING MY PEOPLE TO THE GALLENTEAN HERE? I am slowly losing my patience with the level of idiotic Gallenteans. Should you wish to broach the subject I am only to happy to discuss the matters with you, but not here and not now. "All things were created by the Divine, and so the glory of our faith is inherent to us all"
True Adamance PIE Inc. Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 3977	Posted - 2013.11.07 23:13:00 - [17] - Quote Atiim wrote: True Adamance wrote: Atiim wrote: Yeah, and the Amarr are so good and definitely more ethical. Again I have not mentioned my stance on the Empire, this is not about what my people have done, I misunderstand the need man people seem to have about not being able to accept their actions and feeling the need to throw back tit for tat politics to defend themselves. I know. We're just saying that because of the corp your in. And almost everyone else is just saying what they're saying to jerk your chain. So you are okay with the torture and mistreatment of your own people? I am not angered by the incessant posting, but instead by their assumption that I am open to discussing the entirety of New Eden, such a topic would require a much vaster and more knowledgible group of individuals to tackle, which here we seem to be sorely lacking beside Arkena, and another Matari who has shown me today his people are capable of rational thought. "All things were created by the Divine, and so the glory of our faith is inherent to us all"
True Adamance PIE Inc. Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 3977	Posted - 2013.11.07 23:14:00 - [18] - Quote XANDER KAG wrote: True Adamance wrote: I cannot speak for my people in the past, what we were does not shape who we are now, only shapes the base. I am not blameless in the image people have of the Amarr, if anything I am a symbol of it, though I hold not slaves, or noble blood. So you say I am to blame for the mistakes of my ancestors? Are you personally responsible for the bombing on Caldari Prime? Poor treatment of mortals as you say is not hypocritical, though I respect the need for the Matari to face their own spiritual awakening I will not stand for the mistreatment of slaves. Too many way ward criminals have I hunted down, slaving without the Empires consent, too many Blood Raider facilities have I razed, or Holders detained under the auspices of the Ministries for their sins. You speak as if I do not understand the human condition because of my Faith. Wait, then who is Satja to you then? You specifically state she is a slave in her bio. Unless she belongs to someone else? She does not belong to me, she is indentured in my service on the behalf of a Holder to serve as my aide and support in my duties. I would not state it is uncommon for Templars to be able to own slaves, though I myself am neither held in such high regard not in veterancy. To me she is more than a slave though and a very close friend, someone who saved me when I was at my lowest. "All things were created by the Divine, and so the glory of our faith is inherent to us all"
True Adamance PIE Inc. Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 3977	Posted - 2013.11.07 23:16:00 - [19] - Quote Flaminius-Aurelius Julius wrote: My Friends, my good Caldari friends. Look at the Gallente, don't believe this trash at how the Gallente treat Caldari Prisoners poorly. Do you really think that the Gallente would treat us poorly? We are Gods to them. We are not captured, we are abducted to be worshiped by their primitive rituals and we are offered only the finest of Gallente women (but remember not to actually mix, we don't want any of our pure bloodline being spoiled by some horrible Gallente-Caldari abomination). They give us gifts, treasures, and praise us for our pure bloodlines and great cultural achievements. What the problem is the Gallente State. For they are the real enemy. They shun their inferior brethren for recognizing our greatness and oppress them for the truth that they espouse about us. We must liberate them from their heretical taskmasters and let them realize the true glory of our culture and greatness! LONG LIVE THE CALDARI STATE!!! You shame the Caldari people. "All things were created by the Divine, and so the glory of our faith is inherent to us all"
True Adamance PIE Inc. Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 3979	Posted - 2013.11.07 23:32:00 - [20] - Quote Atiim wrote: May a tear be shed for my brothers imprisoned and tortured by the Gallente Federation. It is a sad shame that many are under the illusion that all of any race can be pure of heart. The ignorance of people who believe this sickens me to the core. While I do hope that one day all four empires will endure a period of Pax Aeterna, I fear that this day will outlast even the life of mine, which is said to be immortal. However, I refuse to sit here and lie to myself and say "The Gallente are evil by nature and the Caldari State is the embodiment of all that is holy and pure". For all races, all empires, and all bloodlines have all inflicted great suffering on others at one point in their existence. Even through millennia of technological and social advancements our human nature will never change. We are all cursed to live in a cycle of pain, anguish, harm, and suffering. I did not state that either, though the meaning of my original state me was clear it seems not all Gallenteans have even registered in mentally yet. "All things were created by the Divine, and so the glory of our faith is inherent to us all"

True Adamance PIE Inc. Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 3980	Posted - 2013.11.07 23:40:00 - [21] - Quote Atiim wrote: Arkena Wyrnspire wrote: Poor treatment of mortals? Hypocrit, much? The sheer number of atrocities you and your people have committed against human beings are unthinkable. Do not waste your time kind woman, for the Amarr do not consider Matri to be human. This is not true. Some Amarr are traditionalists who would venerate the old ways of our people, blood, conquest, and brutality in the name of the Faith. Others and increasingly more so in recent years look to new ways to spread the Faith. Conquest is a double edges sword, effective in most circumstances but wounds taken in battle slowly heal. These newer reformists as I would call them are more and more outspoken in the opinion that slavery is not necessarily the answer or the most efficient way to achieve spiritual enlightenment, and though I shall do as I am instructed by my superiors I do it with earthly regret, since no act in the name of God is to be regretted. You say that I do not think the Matari are human? Then you do not know me, and that is an opinion I have the power to change. "All things were created by the Divine, and so the glory of our faith is inherent to us all"
True Adamance PIE Inc. Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 3980	Posted - 2013.11.07 23:47:00 - [22] - Quote Atiim wrote: True Adamance wrote: Atiim wrote: Arkena Wyrnspire wrote: Poor treatment of mortals? Hypocrit, much? The sheer number of atrocities you and your people have committed against human beings are unthinkable. Do not waste your time kind woman, for the Amarr do not consider Matri to be human. This is not true. Some Amarr are traditionalists who would venerate the old ways of our people, blood, conquest, and brutality in the name of the Faith. Others and increasingly more so in recent years look to new ways to spread the Faith. Conquest is a double edges sword, effective in most circumstances but wounds taken in battle slowly heal. You say that I do not think the Matari are human? Then you do not know me, and that is an opinion I have the power to change. Again, I wasn't referencing you. Maybe I'll put up a disclaimer next time [OOC] I'm betting 100k ISK that this gets moved to the Intergalactic Summit at some point in time And if you could link your bio, I'd appreciate it. (Assuming you have one) (( I do have one, its currently being revised, not greatly the base is still there, just the scenery changing for a more immersive view of Kador's Life. You can find it in the Fiction Section of the forums under character Bios....but Demel wouldn't let me finish it because just the summary is about 6 posts long.)) I know you do not reference me, I am amongst the latter of the Amarr. Religious to my core, but to a Reclaimer in nature. I am bound to the Sarum, and venerate Heideran as one of the greatest emperors of the Amarr. "All things were created by the Divine, and so the glory of our faith is inherent to us all"
True Adamance PIE Inc. Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 3980	Posted - 2013.11.07 23:53:00 - [23] - Quote R'adeh Hunt wrote: XANDER KAG wrote: R'adeh Hunt wrote: True Adamance wrote: Just read the Caldari POW description "Caldari Prisoners of War Caldari Prisoners of War All of these Caldari P.O.Ws show the signs of appalling treatment over an extended period of time. Even the most well-off are still suffering from starvation and serious malnourishment. The worst of them are barely alive after enduring sleep deprivation, physical abuse and other more excessive forms of torture. The women in particular, have not fared well under their Gallente jail masters, who have remorselessly taken whatever they desired from their captured prey. " Man that really makes me want to kill some FDU scum, vile, and depraved monsters. Gallente are angels compared to Amarrians. Those guys are EVE's version of the Taliban. Actually its almost the other way around. But with the religious people being the victims, if you count the Minmatar that is. What? Amarrians justify slavery and their atrocities through their religion. How on earth can you claim they're the victims??? The don't consider it an atrocity, it is a necessary part of life if one is to come to spiritual awakening. Though they had enslaved the Minmatar, much of the aggression between the empires does not come from the Amarr, but the vengeful Minmatar. "All things were created by the Divine, and so the glory of our faith is inherent to us all"
True Adamance PIE Inc. Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 3985	Posted - 2013.11.08 01:05:00 - [24] - Quote Our Deepest Regret wrote: True Adamance wrote: The don't consider it an atrocity, it is a necessary part of life if one is to come to spiritual awakening. Either way this is not relevant to the context of the discussion. " Please stop pointing out the various atrocities my culture has inflicted while I am busy pointing out an atrocity this culture over here has inflicted. That is not how the game is played." The original comment was intended to spark discussion about the Caldari and Gallentean plights, not about that of the empire, had I wished to be inclusive of the empire or exclusive of Caldari and Gallente when in discussion about our plights I would have made a comment about my own people. As such the discussion is constantly being pushed off track. However if you wish to discuss the Amarr I am always happy to do so, just not here or now, as it undermines the point of the original comment. "All things were created by the Divine, and so the glory of our faith is inherent to us all"
True Adamance PIE Inc. Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 3985	Posted - 2013.11.08 01:06:00 - [25] - Quote Vinsarrow wrote: Also the Minmitar are not perfect either prior to Empress Jamyl becoming Empress the Minmitar Elder Fleet attacked a CONCORD warning station & base. After doing so they attacked multiple Amarr world's mass murdering any & all Amarrian on sight & freeing slaves. But Jamyl showed up unexpectedly (as she was thought to be dead) & stopped The Minmitar Elder fleet by literally calling down the thumb of god with some apocalypse's & great ship's. After that she was made Empress. Also do not forget a fleet of Minmitar attacked The Gallente over a Minmitar Bruton who was accused of killing multiple Gallente people & The Minmitar called it obvious self defense but none the less they attacked The Gallente & do not forget Minmitar think sometimes The Gallente are just using them. Again please refrain from comments about the Empire of Republic, they are not within the context of this discussion. "All things were created by the Divine, and so the glory of our faith is inherent to us all"
True Adamance PIE Inc. Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 3989	Posted - 2013.11.08 02:00:00 - [26] - Quote Vrain Matari wrote: True Adamance wrote: Kahn Zo wrote: Oh, do not believe everything that you read. Please. I'm surprised a Gallentean has the balls to say that to me as only 2 players have ever dug deeper into Amarr histories to actually make informed opinions on them. Oh i have dug deep. And years before Jamyl Sarum's vile Templar experiments were even imagined. But there are things in this life that cannot be salvaged. It is not for me or my generation to forgive. In the years to come, when all the children of Pator and Matar have been liberated, those generations born into freedom may choose to forgive.....and forget. And in time there is no doubt that finer sensibilities will regard myself and my brothers-and-sisters-in-arms as broken heroes, as monsters. It is meet and just that this comes to pass. Your affectation of high-minded sensibility towards the Gallente is laughable - it is no different than the perfumed and braided coats of Sarum's slaver hounds. It is artistic adornment on a slavering beast. The filth you spew will deceive only the innocent, Adamance. But we older Matari will not forget and we did not choose immortality to learn forgiveness, Ammarian. The best you can hope for is never-ending death at our hands. The best you can pray for is oblivion and the forgiveness of children. This is why your people will never know peace.... you broach war to lightly, conflict is in you nature. Before us you warred against and enslaved one another, before us you had no Republic, before us you were scatters and in disunion. Our mere influence in your histories irrevocably changed your peoples course into the stars. Again you speak as if you know me, you do not, you have not bothered to understand me as I try to understand you. And as previously stated many times this discussion is not one of my own personal empire though it most certainly could be. This is a statement to all who know the Gallente as the champions of civil liberties as failing themselves. There is no reason for them to treat Caldari POWs so by simply comparing themselves to the Amarr or the other Empires. This is their issue and an issue that I find morally reprehensible, as I am sure any Gallentean might as well. AGAIN I have to reiterate this. If people wish to discuss the Amarr and Minmatar I am happy to do so, just not here and not now. "All things were created by the Divine, and so the glory of our faith is inherent to us all"
True Adamance PIE Inc. Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 3989	Posted - 2013.11.08 02:01:00 - [27] - Quote Yelhsa Jin-Mao wrote: I'll take a Caldari Jail bird, I've heard the Civire females take it up the ass. If only I could hunt you down scum. No human being deserves what those POW's had done to them. "All things were created by the Divine, and so the glory of our faith is inherent to us all"
True Adamance PIE Inc. Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 3989	Posted - 2013.11.08 02:06:00 - [28] - Quote Racro 01 Arifistan wrote: True Adamance wrote: Just read the Caldari POW description "Caldari Prisoners of War Caldari Prisoners of War All of these Caldari P.O.Ws show the signs of appalling treatment over an extended period of time. Even the most well-off are still suffering from starvation and serious malnourishment. The worst of them are barely alive after enduring sleep deprivation, physical abuse and other more excessive forms of torture. The women in particular, have not fared well under their Gallente jail masters, who have remorselessly taken whatever they desired from their captured prey. " Man that really makes me want to kill some FDU scum, vile, and depraved monsters. its all false. its just caldari propaganda to make us look bad.......... HOW MANY OF OUR GALLENTE FEMALES DID YOU **** ON CALDARI PRIME WHILE YOU OCCUPIED IT! ....That is a crass and rather baseless accusation. Do you have accounts to back this up? "All things were created by the Divine, and so the glory of our faith is inherent to us all"
True Adamance PIE Inc. Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 3989	Posted - 2013.11.08 02:11:00 - [29] - Quote Godin Thekiller wrote: Wait, why are we even worrying about it? We don't do this ** to each other (although I do keep a few drugged up bitches in my MQ, although they have free rain to leave anytime the y want). It's all the mortals doing this **. Why are we arguring over the mortals's bullshit? They are who we once were, they are who made us, and defined us, they are the truly immortal for their acts have great significance than our own. "All things were created by the Divine, and so the glory of our faith is inherent to us all"
True Adamance PIE Inc. Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 3989	Posted - 2013.11.08 02:26:00 - [30] - Quote Godin Thekiller wrote: True Adamance wrote: Godin Thekiller wrote: Wait, why are we even worrying about it? We don't do this ** to each other (although I do keep a few drugged up bitches in my MQ, although they have free rain to leave anytime the y want). It's all the mortals doing this . Why are we arguring over the mortals's bullshit? They are who we once were, they are who made us, and defined us, they are the truly immortal for their acts have great significance than our own. It's not like we would just as easily control them. I'm sure they are scared as hell of us. Think about it: We have nothing to lose but ISK. We could die a thousand times, and still live. We can survive all kinds of ** up **, do whatever we want, and the can't really stop us. All we have to do is rise up and fight them. Anyways, although I'm Gallente, and I went to the Academy, i've already died before. I'm just a clone of my former self, and wasn't even made into a merc the usual way. But that's another story for another day. I have no doubt they can stop us.... and it is because they are mortal that they are the only ones who can do it. We could throw, endlessly, clones at one another, with a single life a man fights harder than an immortal knowing he may well die. They are inspired to acts of patriotism that we can never know. Currently the control of clones is likely to primarily in the hands of Mortals will Genolution cornering the market on such commodities. When clones production stops and is limited by mere millions of clones we become no different from mortals don't we? "All things were created by the Divine, and so the glory of our faith is inherent to us all"

True Adamance PIE Inc. Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 3993	Posted - 2013.11.08 02:48:00 - [31] - Quote SgtDoughnut wrote: Well lets see here, in the battle for Caldari prime where both Gal and Caldari citizens lived (both races came from the same solar system) The Caldari used a titan to hold the planet hostage and prevent massive civilian casualties. Gallente just run a scorched earth campaign bombarding the entire planet from orbit with dreadnaughts. Did they bombard the planet? I was only aware that they destroyed the titan, which given the massive Gallente population planetside I think was a callous move, there is no way they couldn't have know it was crash through Caldari Prime's atmosphere. "All things were created by the Divine, and so the glory of our faith is inherent to us all"
True Adamance PIE Inc. Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 4007	Posted - 2013.11.08 08:51:00 - [32] - Quote VAHZZ wrote: Just like an Amarrian to blame someone for something that they themselves have done. Is it not true that the Amarrians have done unspeakable evil towards the Minmatars? enslaving them and treating them as nothing but curs?...calling them scum and hunting them as game?....Caldari's are greedy little savages that would sell their own for a pack of gum and a taco. We Gallente are logical and moral, while you go inquisiting in the name of your empress and slaughtering Minmaters in the name of progress and blind ambition. You have neither read nor bothered to make sense of any statements. I have specifically not mentioned my Empire, nor the Repblic, this discussion is exclusively about the State and Federations. And as you may note I have mentioned I have no illusions about my own Empire, suffice to say it is beyond my control, and that if I have the opportunity to end it I will for I cannot stand such ill treatment of mortals. Your statements also lead me to believe you are mentally incapable of rational though and are the filth that besmirches the Gallentean people with you small mindedness.... I was under the impression the Gallete "welcomed outsiders with open arms, and are fierce defenders of personal and social liberties" yet you will specify which people you do and do not extend those human rights to in a discriminatory manner? "All things were created by the Divine, and so the glory of our faith is inherent to us all"
True Adamance PIE Inc. Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 4008	Posted - 2013.11.08 09:15:00 - [33] - Quote GRIM GEAR wrote: Yeah I totally agree with you they take our plant then crap on us, Though in saying that I am a minmatar in disguise and that comment was actually aimed at those amarrian slave lickers. We treat our slaves better than the Gallente treat their POWs but that is besides the point. "All things were created by the Divine, and so the glory of our faith is inherent to us all"
True Adamance PIE Inc. Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 4008	Posted - 2013.11.08 09:18:00 - [34] - Quote VAHZZ wrote: True Adamance wrote: VAHZZ wrote: Just like an Amarrian to blame someone for something that they themselves have done. Is it not true that the Amarrians have done unspeakable evil towards the Minmatars? enslaving them and treating them as nothing but curs?...calling them scum and hunting them as game?....Caldari's are greedy little savages that would sell their own for a pack of gum and a taco. We Gallente are logical and moral, while you go inquisiting in the name of your empress and slaughtering Minmaters in the name of progress and blind ambition. You have neither read nor bothered to make sense of any statements. I have specifically not mentioned my Empire, nor the Repblic, this discussion is exclusively about the State and Federations. And as you may note I have mentioned I have no illusions about my own Empire, suffice to say it is beyond my control, and that if I have the opportunity to end it I will for I cannot stand such ill treatment of mortals. Your statements also lead me to believe you are mentally incapable of rational though and are the filth that besmirches the Gallentean people with you small mindedness.... I was under the impression the Gallete "welcomed outsiders with open arms, and are fierce defenders of personal and social liberties" yet you will specify which people you do and do not extend those human rights to in a discriminatory manner? You speak as if you have morals...flinging the blame on me as if i'm not right. I never said anything about human rights...I'm talking about you and your people, accusing the Gallente for slave driving while they themselves have done far worse. Then why are you here in a discussion about the Caldari and Gallente and not in one about the Amarr and Minmatar? I am confused, this is the wrong place to vent your dislike of my empire. I am not accusing you of slave driving, I have never said you have made use of slaves, far from it your histories depict slavery as abhorrent, however I am discussing why the Gallente champion human rights then violate them so against a specific group of people.... this is the question I am wishing to pose to those gathered here. Address this issue directly please, do not hide behind your baseless accusations. "All things were created by the Divine, and so the glory of our faith is inherent to us all"
True Adamance PIE Inc. Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 4008	Posted - 2013.11.08 09:22:00 - [35] - Quote Void Echo wrote: True Adamance wrote: VAHZZ wrote: Just like an Amarrian to blame someone for something that they themselves have done. Is it not true that the Amarrians have done unspeakable evil towards the Minmatars? enslaving them and treating them as nothing but curs?...calling them scum and hunting them as game?....Caldari's are greedy little savages that would sell their own for a pack of gum and a taco. We Gallente are logical and moral, while you go inquisiting in the name of your empress and slaughtering Minmaters in the name of progress and blind ambition. You have neither read nor bothered to make sense of any statements. I have specifically not mentioned my Empire, nor the Repblic, this discussion is exclusively about the State and Federations. And as you may note I have mentioned I have no illusions about my own Empire, suffice to say it is beyond my control, and that if I have the opportunity to end it I will for I cannot stand such ill treatment of mortals. Your statements also lead me to believe you are mentally incapable of rational though and are the filth that besmirches the Gallentean people with you small mindedness.... I was under the impression the Gallete "welcomed outsiders with open arms, and are fierce defenders of personal and social liberties" yet you will specify which people you do and do not extend those human rights to in a discriminatory manner? much like how in your empire there are people who denounced slavery (those are the true people of god) and those that did not (may they burn forever in hell). there are people in the federation who share different ideals... are you that biased and blind that you think all gallenteans think the same? Only 3 Gallenteans have provent to be reasonable and likeable individuals capable of rational though. You are one, Denak is another, and Jakar is the other.... I may well be missing one... but what does the plight of the Matari and Amarr, my people histories have to do with the mistreatment of prisoners of war and the violation of human rights in Gallentean prison complexs right now ? "All things were created by the Divine, and so the glory of our faith is inherent to us all"
True Adamance PIE Inc. Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 4009	Posted - 2013.11.08 09:46:00 - [36] - Quote Void Echo wrote: True Adamance wrote: Void Echo wrote: True Adamance wrote: VAHZZ wrote: Just like an Amarrian to blame someone for something that they themselves have done. Is it not true that the Amarrians have done unspeakable evil towards the Minmatars? enslaving them and treating them as nothing but curs?...calling them scum and hunting them as game?....Caldari's are greedy little savages that would sell their own for a pack of gum and a taco. We Gallente are logical and moral, while you go inquisiting in the name of your empress and slaughtering Minmaters in the name of progress and blind ambition. You have neither read nor bothered to make sense of any statements. I have specifically not mentioned my Empire, nor the Repblic, this discussion is exclusively about the State and Federations. And as you may note I have mentioned I have no illusions about my own Empire, suffice to say it is beyond my control, and that if I have the opportunity to end it I will for I cannot stand such ill treatment of mortals. Your statements also lead me to believe you are mentally incapable of rational though and are the filth that besmirches the Gallentean people with you small mindedness.... I was under the impression the Gallete "welcomed outsiders with open arms, and are fierce defenders of personal and social liberties" yet you will specify which people you do and do not extend those human rights to in a discriminatory manner? much like how in your empire there are people who denounced slavery (those are the true people of god) and those that did not (may they burn forever in hell). there are people in the federation who share different ideals... are you that biased and blind that you think all gallenteans think the same? Only 3 Gallenteans have provent to be reasonable and likeable individuals capable of rational though. You are one, Denak is another, and Jakar is the other.... I may well be missing one... but what does the plight of the Matari and Amarr, my people histories have to do with the mistreatment of prisoners of war and the violation of human rights in Gallentean prison complexs right now ? you got in a debate on whether or not the federation discriminates, I had to put my 2 cents in to debunk you The Federation does discriminate, these prisoners are examples of the harsh treatment and **** of female prisoners....how do you justify this? "All things were created by the Divine, and so the glory of our faith is inherent to us all"
True Adamance PIE Inc. Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 4023	Posted - 2013.11.08 21:27:00 - [37] - Quote Denak Kalamari wrote: Sgt Kirk wrote: Let me use a common phrase used often by you to cover up Amarr atrocities. "You're judging us through your own cultural/moral viewpoints." Except that these POWs actually exist And on top of that, where did you get the impression that Amarr slavery is all just brutal and violent abusing? Contrary to popular belief, the Amarr are actually quite nice to their slaves, and have laws that regulate how you can treat them. I may not agree on why they do slavery, but they are not brutal slavers unlike everyone here thinks. And one of the reasonable and respectable Intaki/Federal aligned mercenaries presents a sound opinion with knowledge of the subjects at hand. Thank you Denak, but of course as I have said the was the Amarr treat their slaves, what they have done in the past does not impact how the Gallente are currently treating POWs. "All things were created by the Divine, and so the glory of our faith is inherent to us all"
True Adamance PIE Inc. Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 4023	Posted - 2013.11.08 21:47:00 - [38] - Quote VAHZZ wrote: Ok, not slave drivers but war criminals..my point still stands...the Amarr have done far worse, i never said i agreed upon which my people have done in the past..since it was not civilized, but i will not push away facts. But that is precisely my point. With your current argument of "I cannot and wont accept something bad someone has presented with physical (digital) evidence so I will try to denounce my reasonable opponents argument by throwing accusations at him". Firstly and I will deign to address this now, you say the Amarr have done far worse but you do not specify what. If you mean to imply the slavery that has defined us throughout the ages then you must know that the slaves we take are not taken so the sake of a cheap labour force nor because the Amarr think of the other races as sub human. We engage in such practices because we believe that subservience and trial will bring a person closer to God. The Amarr themselves were driven from their lands on Athra to the Island of Amarr by the Udorians many millennia ago, while the Gallente and Minmatar sat on paradise worlds and received none of the divine callings we did. It stems from our belief that when one person is toiling is service to our God, they become closer to him, a part of the larger whole, a cog in the great machine, and in doing this their actions become eternal and far more meaningful. The practice of slavery is for all intensive purposes a term of indentured labour, all client races are eventually emancipated when they are determined to be ready for the responsibilities of taking up the Immortal Destiny of the Amarr peoples. An example of this are the Ni Kunni who were enslaved before the Minmatar. They were willing to submit to the Faith, they did it meekly, and embraced the cultural tenets of the Amarr and within one generations nearly 95% of their indentured peoples had been made free citizens of the Empire. If you mean to say that the Amarrian treatment of slaves was and has been callous throughout our time, mainly in the case of the Minmatar, I cannot deny this, prior to the Rebellions our people had not met a race like the Minmatar who were so obstinate in the face of cultural change. In order to pacify the slaves taken, the elders had to be separated from the peoples and rather barbaric tools had to be used to attempt to drive the Matari into subservience as all previously effective tools had failed. Post Rebellion, in his later years Emperor Heideran came t regret the turn his people had taken and outlawed the mistreatment of slaves under pain of death or slavery itself. Mistreatment is still not fully eradicated from our society, it only perpetuates now because of the way our society works. It take a great many resources, evidence, and time to move against corrupt Holders and nobility. As for any other concerns that the Amarr are actively committing openly evil acts I will be happy to address them, though I hope my latter statements have helped you to better understand our people. What you perceive as slavery is to us a necessary part of the acceptance of people into the Empire. Poignantly and with regreted, and in ignoring many of my previous statements, can you personally refute that the Minmatar were once slavers? That they killed their own people and took them as slaves? Do not be so quick to denounce what you do not know. Will you refute that when Empress Jamyll emancipated the 9th and bove Generation Slaves and Theologically educated servant that the Minmatar did not gather and massacre a gathering their blood kin for remaining faithful to the Amarr Faith? I am not interested in this tit for tat, admittedly I have started it in this instance, blood for blood is a barbaric and ignorant practice. I prefer what can be done here and now. Why is there not a single Gallentean that can accept that his people have done this on a massive scale throughout the federation, and be saddened by this poor treatment of humans and the violation of their own cultural tenets. "All things were created by the Divine, and so the glory of our faith is inherent to us all"
True Adamance PIE Inc. Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 4024	Posted - 2013.11.08 22:14:00 - [39] - Quote Denak Kalamari wrote: True Adamance wrote: And one of the reasonable and respectable Intaki/Federal aligned mercenaries presents a sound opinion with knowledge of the subjects at hand. Thank you Denak, but of course as I have said the was the Amarr treat their slaves, what they have done in the past does not impact how the Gallente are currently treating POWs. I was simply clearing up false information, I can't stand ignorant people spouting out things they have no clue about. Speaking of which, I'm still not Gallente or Federal aligned. Get it right. My apologies, seems that the Gallente have one less rational and intelligent individual amongst their ranks. I also cannot stand the ignorance of the Gallenteans, they show utter disregard for factual evidence, reasoned arguments and a self centred system of thoughts and values that will never allow them to push their views to all of mankind. ((Note when I state this last point I wish to highlight that the Amarr think everything they re doing is a gift to the other peoples of new eden, don't mistake its meaning)) "All things were created by the Divine, and so the glory of our faith is inherent to us all"
True Adamance PIE Inc. Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 4025	Posted - 2013.11.08 22:52:00 - [40] - Quote 1st Lieutenant Tiberius wrote: Everyone is Evil. The Sinwarden would say that, though the purpose of this thread was to highlight the plight of Caldari POWs under gallentean prison wardens, buzz words like Evil are only present for the effect they have on the people who read them. The Gallente should know, it is they who are the masters of propaganda. "All things were created by the Divine, and so the glory of our faith is inherent to us all"

True Adamance PIE Inc. Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 4025	Posted - 2013.11.08 23:16:00 - [41] - Quote Alaika Arbosa wrote: Vinsarrow wrote: Alaika Arbosa wrote: Denak Kalamari wrote: Sgt Kirk wrote: Let me use a common phrase used often by you to cover up Amarr atrocities. "You're judging us through your own cultural/moral viewpoints." Except that these POWs actually exist And on top of that, where did you get the impression that Amarr slavery is all just brutal and violent abusing? Contrary to popular belief, the Amarr are actually quite nice to their slaves, and have laws that regulate how you can treat them. I may not agree on why they do slavery, but they are not brutal slavers unlike everyone here thinks. Since you believe everything you are told, I am Jovian. Seriously though, those laws are only on the books for show. If you haven't personally experienced the horrors of slavery, I'd recommend you not lecture us about it or try to tell me and my brethren and how the Amarr treat us. So you denouce the lore as false this sounds similar to that 1 Gallentean saying "Don't believe everything you read." problem is he researched & got the evidence also since you haven't researched the lore & facts nor as perhaps being a new generation Minmitar says you yourself may not have experienced it yourself so how do you know if they were good or bad? It depends on the person some could be good some could be bad. But the fact is if the bad are caught mistreating the servants can be punished VERY harshly.... If you researched it, you would know what punishments can & have been done. History is written by the victors. @True The emancipation is a joke. Releasing those who've been enslaved for 9th generations, likely broken of spirit and will, is nothing more than a slap in the face. If she truly cared for the plight of the Tribes, she'd free all slaves and gives the Tribes reparations. No reparations, no peace. Reparations for what? Seeking to uplift your people, to join them with our own, to give you the God we hold so dear? These are all things we have done for you. In anycase the Matari are not blameless in this as well, millions died in the rebellions, Amarr, Minmatar, and more, our conflict spiralled out of control and more were dragged needlessly into it. As for the 9th generation slaves I see no issue with that, the slaves are not treated unfairly, except by angered Minmatar on their return to republic space, they are given educations, both in the religious nature of the Amarr and in the wider universe around them. After they are freed they have no obligation to remain faithful, yet many still do, while other simply return to their peoples to live out their lives as normal Matari. It is in our mandates that we free all of those who are ready to receive God's blessings and continue to educate those who are not. The Empress does of course care for the Minmatar, we see you as our own people in rebellion, but she has her duty to uphold the Empire first and foremost. You do not arm your foes and starve your people do you? I do not believe reparations are a necessity to making peace, I also wonder what your ideal of reparations are. Of course you might consider the emancipation a slap in the face, many Matari much more mild in temperament than you, they would be happy to have their children and family members back, however of course many still cannot reconcile themselves with the past and will continue to war. I have seen very few movements from your governing parties to reconcile our differences. Long my Empress Jamyll Sarum's, and Emperor Heideran's influences guide our actions into the future. "All things were created by the Divine, and so the glory of our faith is inherent to us all"
True Adamance PIE Inc. Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 4025	Posted - 2013.11.08 23:25:00 - [42] - Quote Void Echo wrote: True Adamance wrote: The Federation does discriminate, these prisoners are examples of the harsh treatment and **** of female prisoners....how do you justify this? prisoners of war, throughout history everyone tortured their prisoners. im all for humiliation and destruction of my enemy. how do you justify those that still use slavery in your empire? Okay now you are slipping into stupid Gallentean.... I have spent this entire thread telling people this is not with regard to the empire. You cannot throw accusations at my people and use that as a cover justifying your vastly different social climate and political structure as a means of justifying and act that goes against all that your people and the Gallenteans here so often say they support. I am not attacking you from an Imperial Stand point, but instead from the stand point of one who has witnessed these people suffering, seen their scars and been outraged. Besides that what does Amarrian slavery have to do with Gallenteans mistreating and raping POW's? "All things were created by the Divine, and so the glory of our faith is inherent to us all"
True Adamance PIE Inc. Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 4025	Posted - 2013.11.08 23:35:00 - [43] - Quote Atiim wrote: Void Echo wrote: True Adamance wrote: The Federation does discriminate, these prisoners are examples of the harsh treatment and **** of female prisoners....how do you justify this? prisoners of war, throughout history everyone tortured their prisoners. im all for humiliation and destruction of my enemy. how do you justify those that still use slavery in your empire? True Adamance has clearly stated that he is not saying the Amarr or any other empire is better because of this incident. Wow you Gallente "Freedom" Fighters are very sadistic. One guy stated that he kidnaps Caldari women and sexually tortures them. And now you say that it is perfectly fine to treat another human being unethically for the simple sake of their humiliation? Please, you are insulting the small remaining intelligence that is left in New Eden. Please leave. All I wish is for someone acknowledge the problem and attempt to take it to higher authorities even should it not take to their sensibilities. "All things were created by the Divine, and so the glory of our faith is inherent to us all"
True Adamance PIE Inc. Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 4025	Posted - 2013.11.08 23:57:00 - [44] - Quote MINA Longstrike wrote: The Caldari would probably do worse to gallente POW's, there is kind of a long standing racial hatred between the two going all the way back to when the caldari state tried to pull out of the gallente federation because it wasn't in their best interests any longer. The federation got upset because the caldari essentially tried to close their doors like imperial Japan. Things got bad for the caldari which led to freedom fighters (arguably the worst bunch among them being the Templis Dragonaurs) which led to the attack on nouvelle rouvenor... Which prompted the gallente into the harshest response - the bombing of caldari prime. Caldari primes bombing led to the sacrifice (and martyrdom) of Admiral Yakiya Tovil-Toba and his fleet and then the caldari-gallente war was in full swing. In relatively recent history there have been a lot more bad things like the attack on malkalen and the rise to power of Tibus Heth and a whole lot more, but its always important to remember that these guys hate each other. The caldari hate the gallente because the gallente tried to genocide them. The gallente hate the caldari because they're a 'closed society' and because gallente military doctrine is 'they destroy one of our cities we destroy one of their planets' This is not a discussion of could have, might, or would have. It is about what IS happening now. I appreciate that you are quite knowledgeable, so I thank you for your imput, but without proof of Caldari mistreating POW's I cannot revise my opinion. "All things were created by the Divine, and so the glory of our faith is inherent to us all"
True Adamance PIE Inc. Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 4025	Posted - 2013.11.09 00:18:00 - [45] - Quote Tallen Ellecon wrote: True Adamance wrote: MINA Longstrike wrote: The Caldari would probably do worse to gallente POW's, there is kind of a long standing racial hatred between the two going all the way back to when the caldari state tried to pull out of the gallente federation because it wasn't in their best interests any longer. The federation got upset because the caldari essentially tried to close their doors like imperial Japan. Things got bad for the caldari which led to freedom fighters (arguably the worst bunch among them being the Templis Dragonaurs) which led to the attack on nouvelle rouvenor... Which prompted the gallente into the harshest response - the bombing of caldari prime. Caldari primes bombing led to the sacrifice (and martyrdom) of Admiral Yakiya Tovil-Toba and his fleet and then the caldari-gallente war was in full swing. In relatively recent history there have been a lot more bad things like the attack on malkalen and the rise to power of Tibus Heth and a whole lot more, but its always important to remember that these guys hate each other. The caldari hate the gallente because the gallente tried to genocide them. The gallente hate the caldari because they're a 'closed society' and because gallente military doctrine is 'they destroy one of our cities we destroy one of their planets' This is not a discussion of could have, might, or would have. It is about what IS happening now. I appreciate that you are quite knowledgeable, so I thank you for your imput, but without proof of Caldari mistreating POW's I cannot revise my opinion. I didn't think Caldari took POWs? They do. (( I believe there was mention of a Caldari prison complex back in the 2009 Demo's....would lead us to believe that they do.... but I was also under the impression they killed almost all of those they fought.)) "All things were created by the Divine, and so the glory of our faith is inherent to us all"
True Adamance PIE Inc. Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 4026	Posted - 2013.11.09 01:56:00 - [46] - Quote Meeko Fent wrote: The Amarr use slave collars to control their slaves. The Gallente don't feed POWs. Just thinking, isn't their something in CONCORD about treatment of war prisoners? Cause there should. We don't use slave collars in a physical sense. "All things were created by the Divine, and so the glory of our faith is inherent to us all"
True Adamance PIE Inc. Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 4031	Posted - 2013.11.09 03:45:00 - [47] - Quote Meeko Fent wrote: True Adamance wrote: Meeko Fent wrote: The Amarr use slave collars to control their slaves. The Gallente don't feed POWs. Just thinking, isn't their something in CONCORD about treatment of war prisoners? Cause there should. We don't use slave collars in a physical sense. Oh, right that stuff my amarrian neighbor drips into her indentured servants glass of water at dinner. Whatever that stuff is called One more comment about Satja and I flay you alive no matter who you serve. "All things were created by the Divine, and so the glory of our faith is inherent to us all"
True Adamance PIE Inc. Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 4032	Posted - 2013.11.09 04:19:00 - [48] - Quote medomai grey wrote: It's funny how the player base loves to rag on the Amarr about slavery. If any of them actually read some lore, they'd know it's not as bad as it sounds; although by nature it's still unethical. The Nation's slavery on the other hand is the stuff of nightmares. Seriously if you want to rag on slavery, go read the lore on the Nation. I have had my run ins with the Nation before..... horrific things they do to good people. The Blood Raiders also have particularly barbaric side to their slavery, the blood pens are not a pleasant sight. "All things were created by the Divine, and so the glory of our faith is inherent to us all"
True Adamance PIE Inc. Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 4033	Posted - 2013.11.09 04:47:00 - [49] - Quote Thaddeus Reynolds wrote: I believe I read an old supposedly Terran saying in a Sisters of Eve Archive somewhere...said something about glass houses and stones...It may not seem like much, but trust me it's a good read...whether from the perspective of Amarr, Gallente, Caldari, or Mattari...all have committed great "atrocities" in the name of "defending their people." Such things as Gallente Battle-Cruisers gunning down evacuation ships carrying thousands of innocent civilians, just to kill one Caldari Official. Some slave masters in both The Empire and The Kingdom, who do not understand the purpose of the practice. The Caldari holding a whole planet of civilians hostage, even if it was their original homeworld. The Republic Elder Fleet's rampage, only brought to an end by The Empress, not to mention their tactics throughout the war. I digress, in the matter at hand of Gallente vs Caldari, I more often than not trust the consistent nature of the Caldari, to the variable so called "Freedom" of the Gallente...that's not to say Caldari are any more or less evil than the Gallente...they'll just usually kill you to your face (if they kill you). Oh my god I didn't think one of my own brethren would say this.... and be this stupid. Whether or not you agree with Amarrian slavery is irrelevant, amarrian slavery itself is irrelevant in this topic. The issue is CALDARI and GALLENTEAN INTERESTS! Not our own, nor of the Minmatar, purely CALDARI and GALLENTEAN.... "All things were created by the Divine, and so the glory of our faith is inherent to us all"
True Adamance PIE Inc. Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 4033	Posted - 2013.11.09 05:00:00 - [50] - Quote Thaddeus Reynolds wrote: True Adamance wrote: Thaddeus Reynolds wrote: I believe I read an old supposedly Terran saying in a Sisters of Eve Archive somewhere...said something about glass houses and stones...It may not seem like much, but trust me it's a good read...whether from the perspective of Amarr, Gallente, Caldari, or Mattari...all have committed great "atrocities" in the name of "defending their people." Such things as Gallente Battle-Cruisers gunning down evacuation ships carrying thousands of innocent civilians, just to kill one Caldari Official. Some slave masters in both The Empire and The Kingdom, who do not understand the purpose of the practice. The Caldari holding a whole planet of civilians hostage, even if it was their original homeworld. The Republic Elder Fleet's rampage, only brought to an end by The Empress, not to mention their tactics throughout the war. I digress, in the matter at hand of Gallente vs Caldari, I more often than not trust the consistent nature of the Caldari, to the variable so called "Freedom" of the Gallente...that's not to say Caldari are any more or less evil than the Gallente...they'll just usually kill you to your face (if they kill you). Oh my god I didn't think one of my own brethren would say this.... and be this stupid. Whether or not you agree with Amarrian slavery is irrelevant, amarrian slavery itself is irrelevant in this topic. The issue is CALDARI and GALLENTEAN INTERESTS! Not our own, nor of the Minmatar, purely CALDARI and GALLENTEAN.... Also you seem to be under them impression that I cannot separate my duties to my Empire from my personal opinions.... this is a fallacy. I am of the Kingdom, and while part of The Empire, my loyalties are to The King. I merely listed the mistreatment (which is misusing the practice of uplifting) of the slaves, in order to demonstrate that there are many sides to the issue, and I did go back to the issue at hand, stating that: In general, I trust Caldari over Gallente. Caldari is the lesser of two proverbial evils in the issue at hand. I have made the relevant text more easily discerned from my previous post True enough Khanid the mistreatment of slaves however is a breach of the Empire's Laws. Such laws are enforced by those loyal to the empress and the Ministry of Internal Order. Laws set forth by Emperor Heideran, and any who dare contravene those laws are not of the Amarr. "All things were created by the Divine, and so the glory of our faith is inherent to us all"

True Adamance PIE Inc. Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 4042	Posted - 2013.11.10 21:52:00 - [51] - Quote The Robot Devil wrote: Search for the speaker of truths. You'll like it. I do. It speaks of justice. "All things were created by the Divine, and so the glory of our faith is inherent to us all"
True Adamance PIE Inc. Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 4045	Posted - 2013.11.10 22:01:00 - [52] - Quote Cat Merc wrote: No one's perfect. But when all four empires' atrocities are compared, Gallente seem to have the least of them. Not by much to make a difference for the people suffering, but enough for the other races to take a good hard look at themselves before shouting at the Gallente. Again I just want to reiterate this isn't about who did what to who and in return did this the them, who then decided to.... Its a stand alone accusation of guilt at the treatment of POW's within the Gallentean Federation, who above all represent the drive to equality and fair treatment as well as observances of human rights.... something that in recent years has seemingly been lacking in the Federation under Roden's heel. No one should have to go through malnourishment, physical torture, and **** while as POW's yet this happens, I am unaware of any such instances within the Empire, but then again there is much I do not know. All I can do is bring this issue to light and hope that as many people walk away with this in their minds as possible, and that some day one of you will be able to stop this, or save even one person from this kind of brutal treatment. "All things were created by the Divine, and so the glory of our faith is inherent to us all"
True Adamance PIE Inc. Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 4045	Posted - 2013.11.10 22:12:00 - [53] - Quote Cat Merc wrote: Waruiko DUST wrote: Minmatar is Israel Caldari is the Tea Party and GOP Galente is French Canada Amarr is the Catholic Church How is Minmatar Israel exactly? I am an Israeli and I don't see the connection Too many people try to mistakenly label the Empires of New Eden this way. "All things were created by the Divine, and so the glory of our faith is inherent to us all"
True Adamance PIE Inc. Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 4046	Posted - 2013.11.10 22:24:00 - [54] - Quote Cat Merc wrote: True Adamance wrote: Cat Merc wrote: No one's perfect. But when all four empires' atrocities are compared, Gallente seem to have the least of them. Not by much to make a difference for the people suffering, but enough for the other races to take a good hard look at themselves before shouting at the Gallente. Again I just want to reiterate this isn't about who did what to who and in return did this the them, who then decided to.... Its a stand alone accusation of guilt at the treatment of POW's within the Gallentean Federation, who above all represent the drive to equality and fair treatment as well as observances of human rights.... something that in recent years has seemingly been lacking in the Federation under Roden's heel. No one should have to go through malnourishment, physical torture, and **** while as POW's yet this happens, I am unaware of any such instances within the Empire, but then again there is much I do not know. All I can do is bring this issue to light and hope that as many people walk away with this in their minds as possible, and that some day one of you will be able to stop this, or save even one person from this kind of brutal treatment. That I agree with. And that is all I wanted. A Gallentean to openly admit there was a problem, and that they too agree this is not right. Such an admission reflects better on your people than the denial of guilt in overwhelming evidence, and brings me one step closer to relinquishing my long held dislike of the Federation. "All things were created by the Divine, and so the glory of our faith is inherent to us all"
True Adamance PIE Inc. Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 4046	Posted - 2013.11.10 22:34:00 - [55] - Quote Sgt Kirk wrote: I call bullshit on that True Adamance, you've heard from me and a few other Gallente RPers that there was a problem with our federation, even worse crimes than this before. And I did not care.... recent events.... have forced me to revise my previously help opinions. Prior to now I could at best been described as haughty and arrogant, solely concerned with the business of the Empire and a known denouncer of the Matari for the least of simple sins. That time is done, arrogance is a weakness in me that I have tried to leave behind. ....In seeing these people first hand though..... these mortals so poorly treated... well I suppose its well known I have a soft spot for mortals. "All things were created by the Divine, and so the glory of our faith is inherent to us all"
True Adamance PIE Inc. Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 4046	Posted - 2013.11.10 23:25:00 - [56] - Quote Dagger-Two wrote: True Adamance wrote: I am unaware of any such instances within the Empire, but then again there is much I do not know. Ohhhhh my, yes there IS a lot you do not know it seems. You see, before Vitoc came around, slaves were not exactly treated well, and by that I mean they were worked to death by the thousands. Whipped, beaten, tortured, you name it. That may not exist anymore, but ONLY because Vitoc makes your slaves nice and drunk, happy to live in a stupor, because if they don't get the mind-numbing antidote, they die a horrible painful death. Yes, this sure is much more humane. How far your people have come... Or lets not forget the more recent debacle of the 62nd printing of the Pax 'Ammaria'. If you do not know about this one, and I suspect you don't, let me give you the short and sweet version. All because of this one simple typo: spelling 'Ammaria' instead of 'Amarria'. The court chamberlains order for the misprinted copied to be purged due to what was a perceived grandiose error, meant that the Ordinators of the Court Chamberlain began their ferocious hunt for the books, and since it was ordered that ALL copied be purged, and the word of the office of the Court Chamberlain is absolute, as the books became harder and harder to find your own people went as far as USING ORBITAL STRIKES ON AMARRIAN COLONIES SUSPECTED OF HARBORING A SINGLE COPY. You government has literally killed thousands of its own innocent people because of a spelling error. Enjoy digesting that one. I believe the point of all this is, that every empire has committed its own atrocities. Were Caldari POW's mistreated? Most likely yes, both in this case and many cases before. But have no doubts that Gallentean POW's have been equally mistreated by Caldari jailers, and Minmatar and Amarr POW's also maimed and tortured by the other. As long as people from one empire hate those of another for no reason, this will continue. No one empire is cleaner than the other, no matter how hard you try and convince yourselves. By the by, source of the Pax Ammaria story Here Yes, this is public knowledge. I also have access to a copy, if you ever want to borrow it... ((Will respond properly at lunch...though you cannot assume my character knows everything that is public in New Eden.... he is limited by what I know, and I know only so much....I have not had 5 years to learn it like you might have)) Suffice my argument, which I shall expand upon later, I can accept what my people have done in the past, though it is not a reflection of me or what I represent. However the Amarr and Minmatar are not a facet of this discussion. Please do not get side tracked by the buzz word Evil in the title. This is more about acknowledging a problem within the Federation that openly contradicts much of what the Gallente supposedly stand for. "All things were created by the Divine, and so the glory of our faith is inherent to us all"
True Adamance PIE Inc. Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 4046	Posted - 2013.11.10 23:57:00 - [57] - Quote MINA Longstrike wrote: medomai grey wrote: It's funny how the player base loves to rag on the Amarr about slavery. If any of them actually read some lore, they'd know it's not as bad as it sounds; although by nature it's still unethical. The Nation's slavery on the other hand is the stuff of nightmares. Seriously if you want to rag on slavery, go read the lore on the Nation. Some of it isn't as bad as it sounds, some of it is far worse than it sounds. Have you ever seen a minmatar girlchild willingly walk to her molestor for a dose of vitoc? I have, in fact I've seen worse. I doubt you have ever seen a Holder.... "All things were created by the Divine, and so the glory of our faith is inherent to us all"
True Adamance PIE Inc. Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 4051	Posted - 2013.11.11 01:42:00 - [58] - Quote Meeko Fent wrote: Cat Merc wrote: No one's perfect. But when all four empires' atrocities are compared, Gallente seem to have the least of them. Not by much to make a difference for the people suffering, but enough for the other races to take a good hard look at themselves before shouting at the Gallente. I think that the Gallente are low on the scale of atrocities, however the least "evil" is a bit of a stretch Gallente- Don't feed POWs, EXTREME wealth differences Caldari- Value dollars and efficency more then people Amarr- religious slavers Minmatar- (I really don't know what the minis do wrong) Vagabonds? I feel that Gallenteans are either below Amarr or below Caldari. I feel that no one empire can be truly labeled evil, but the Amarr and Gallente have more stains on their history compared to Caldari and Minmatar. That's from my knowledge of the empires. That's and odd perception though understandable I suppose since the Gallente and Amarr are expansionist empires not matter how you look at it. "All things were created by the Divine, and so the glory of our faith is inherent to us all"
True Adamance PIE Inc. Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 4055	Posted - 2013.11.11 02:02:00 - [59] - Quote Meeko Fent wrote: True Adamance wrote: Meeko Fent wrote: Cat Merc wrote: No one's perfect. But when all four empires' atrocities are compared, Gallente seem to have the least of them. Not by much to make a difference for the people suffering, but enough for the other races to take a good hard look at themselves before shouting at the Gallente. I think that the Gallente are low on the scale of atrocities, however the least "evil" is a bit of a stretch Gallente- Don't feed POWs, EXTREME wealth differences Caldari- Value dollars and efficency more then people Amarr- religious slavers Minmatar- (I really don't know what the minis do wrong) Vagabonds? I feel that Gallenteans are either below Amarr or below Caldari. I feel that no one empire can be truly labeled evil, but the Amarr and Gallente have more stains on their history compared to Caldari and Minmatar. That's from my knowledge of the empires. That's and odd perception though understandable I suppose since the Gallente and Amarr are expansionist empires not matter how you look at it. I just consider both of your histories equally stained in "bad tings" I don't need your opinion just your sympathies Caldari, these are your people. "All things were created by the Divine, and so the glory of our faith is inherent to us all"

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